Budget cuts kick in; goal hit, on paper
Still, slashing $4 trillion seen as having downside
Posted: March 3, 2013 at 4:21 a.m.
President Barack Obama and House Speaker John Boehner are digging in their heels over spending and taxes even as a harsh round of cuts begins to take effect.
The latest budget impasse ushered in a new round of belt tightening Saturday, with the nation facing reduced federal services, canceled contracts, job furloughs and layoffs.
This story is only available from our archives.
Front Section, Pages 1 on 03/03/2013
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Comments
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Obama and those ignorant Democrats are ruining our Naiton as we know it. They care nothing about our military, the middle class, the poor, business, our children and grand children, or the 1st & 2nd admendments. If you don't agree to their ridiculous ideas, you are their enemy.
We are going to be exactly like Europe very soon.
Lord help us!!!!
Posted by: footballfan
March 3, 2013 at 7:26 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
When only a few can bring down the economy of a Country, possibly of the World, you should learn now what it is like to live with the concept of the “chosen people”.
Welcome to the ideal of a Greater Israel.
“Many simultaneous rebellions stirred up in Arab Countries will benefit in the end only the State of Israel with the expansion of its territory
while...
in Europe and in the US, the financial resources "like magic" will disappear through bailouts, tax cuts and elaborated emergency maneuvers which will be ruled only to appear beneficial for those Countries but instead appositely designed for their collapse (except for England that will push Europe over the precipice).
The Deception supported by the media is the Zionist main weapon and there is a risk that people will realize what is happening only when it will be too late and there will be no alternatives.
Thus, one should not listen to the media but observe the events.
TV media and newspapers will never tell you that an Israeli firm had placed the explosives that brought down the 3 buildings in NY on 9/11. ICTS was the only security firm in charge for the twin towers and building 7 (most people still do not know about this building that fell without being hit by any plane or other). ICTS was also the security company in charge for all airports that had allowed the highjack planes on 9/11 to depart. The work force of ICTS was the only people to have access at night inside the 3 buildings and to allow Israeli agents to place those explosives inconspicuously before 9/11. Israeli agents were in fact arrested nearby on 9/11 transporting large amount of explosives in a white van (Chevrolet 2000) but they were later released by the Bush administration. Not as a coincidence, the same day, on 9/11 2001, and at the same time, a CIA operation called Able Danger was reproducing a military exercise that was supposed to mimic an attack by few planes crashing on buildings. But all this was never reported by the media although the future of all people depends on how 9/11 is intended.
First of its kind, this worldwide crisis was provoked through a terror event (9/11) plotted by a US president, George Bush, in cahoots with the Israeli Mossad.
This event was plotted to destabilize the equilibrium of every Country and trigger a chain of events almost unavoidable all of them part of the same Plan.”
There is only one Solution for this planned chain of events.
www.wavevolution.org/en/index.html
Posted by: wavettore
March 3, 2013 at 1:02 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Let's get the republican position on the sequester they overwhelmingly voted for:
http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos...
Posted by: fayfreethinker
March 3, 2013 at 1:17 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
The sequester was Obama's idea from the very beginning. He now acts like it is a terrible thing. The low informed voters really believe he is trying to do the right thing. This is the democrats fault all the way.
Posted by: footballfan
March 3, 2013 at 1:32 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
I'm glad we have the sequester. At least we are cutting the budget - oh, wait, we have no budget. All the more to like the sequester. Obama did not have to cut what he did and would not compromise with much less hurtful cuts. That was his plan from the beginning. It is his fault, no matter how much he whines and points the finger.
He just wants to bring down the rich, but at the same time, he will bring down the whole country. Many rich are generous and fair citizens. Much of what they do for the country will be halted with the ever rising taxes on them. There is a lot of room for compromise. We need a leader and Obama has shown he is not one.
Posted by: mycentworth
March 3, 2013 at 2:27 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Today is the 1400th day without a budget from the democrat controlled Senate. The GOP controlled House passes one every year. The Senate is a disgrace, especially Harry Reid.
Posted by: footballfan
March 3, 2013 at 3:31 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
OK the one who left the padded cell open the enabled wavettore to get to a computer needs to come forward and apologize the all the posters and readers. And I mean, sincerely apologize.
Posted by: Moneymyst
March 3, 2013 at 5:29 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
FootB: "The sequester was Obama's idea... He now acts like it is a terrible thing.">>
It was designed to be a terrible thing (and overwhelming supported by your republicans, I can pull the voting record if you like). It was designed to be so dumb that even republicans wouldn't let it happen. Underestimated that one!
Footb: "The low informed voters...">>
You might want to avoid the topic of "low informed voters" Mr. Football.
Footb: "This is the democrats fault all the way.">>
Americans now trust Democrats more than republicans on every, single, domestic, issue:
http://maddowblog.msnbc.com/_news/201...
And they also know that compromise is a dirty word in conservative land. People who like simplistic black/white up/down answers, sometimes would rather commit societal suicide than engage in the necessarily democratic process of compromise. Some call them "suicide conservatives." I just call them fanatics, and quite harmful to a well functioning society.
D.
------------
"The ‘suicidal’ Republican resistance to compromise"
Excerpt:
"In his column last Saturday, the New York Times‘ Charles Blow referred to these unbendable Republicans as “suicide conservatives.” These are the folks that will not support any sort of compromise even among their own party. Not only are these conservative partisans willing to go down, but they’ll take down those around them."
http://tv.msnbc.com/2013/02/13/the-su...
Posted by: fayfreethinker
March 3, 2013 at 6:36 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Only a fool would use msnbc and fayettevile free radical thinkers as a proof to anything. Only a fool would click on a link unless you completly trust the person who put it up there. Who in God's green creation trusts Freeby?
Posted by: Moneymyst
March 3, 2013 at 7:03 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
FFT: Face it, your President doesn't care about the people. He could have stopped the cuts like a good leader would. He wanted the sequester to happen and thought lthe people would blame the repubs. He tried his "apocolypse" tactic and it didn't work. He is the fault of these cuts. He could have stopped it but he just plays games; he is not a leader to be trusted. If we don't get this fiscal house in order, people don't realize how bad it will be. We are so self-absorbed and the time is getting very short. Next is the debt ceiling crisis again. More debt to China - if they lend us any. If not, then WHAT?? Apocolyse? Maybe.
Posted by: mycentworth
March 3, 2013 at 7:04 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Obama the traitor will default on the citizens of the US before he defaults on China.
Posted by: Moneymyst
March 3, 2013 at 7:43 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
MyC: "Face it, your President doesn't care about the people.">>
Funny, the American people rehired him for the gig, and as I just showed above, they also trust Demo's on all of the main domestic issues.
MyC: "He could have stopped the cuts like a good leader would.">>
I suppose he could have given a bunch of tax cuts to the rich and made major cuts to things that help the poor, but if the American people had wanted that kind of nonsense, they would have voted for the wealthy Mormon guy.
MyC: "He wanted the sequester to happen...">>
No, he absolutely did not.
MyC: "thought lthe people would blame the repubs.">>
If he does (and he probably does because he's smart), he's also probably right. The republicans tried this nonsense in the mid '90's, with famous results.
MyC: "He is the fault of these cuts.">>
It was overwhelmingly approved by your republicans.
MyC: "We are so self-absorbed and the time is getting very short.">>
I know, "He is coming quickly." --circa 1,900 years ago.
MyC: "More debt to China">>
China has a small portion of our debt.
MyC: "if they lend us any. If not, then WHAT??">>
We'll print more. Money is a human abstraction. You shouldn't get yourself so worked up about it. You live in the best time in human existence and in the county with the greatest collection of wealth. Quit whining about silly stuff and enjoy your life. Soon it will be over and then you will be gone.
D.
------------
"Moreover -- if I may put another strain on you -- he [Man] thinks he is the Creator's pet. He believes the Creator is proud of him; he even believes the Creator loves him; has a passion for him; sits up nights to admire him; yes, and watch over him and keep him out of trouble. He prays to Him, and thinks He listens. Isn't it a quaint idea? Fills his prayers with crude and bald and florid flatteries of Him, and thinks He sits and purrs over these extravaganicies and enjoys them. He prays for help, and favor, and protection, every day; and does it with hopefulness and confidence, too, although no prayer of his has ever been answered. The daily affront, the daily defeat, do not discourage him, he goes on praying just the same. There is something almost fine about this perseverance. I must put one more strain upon you: he thinks he is going to heaven!" -- Mark Twain, "Letters from the Earth"
Posted by: fayfreethinker
March 3, 2013 at 8:23 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
"Only a fool would click on a link unless you completly trust the person who put it up there.">>
Only a fool would run a computer online without some sort of virus protection.
Sometimes when wingnuts or trolls can't keep up with the conversation, they'll lie and suggest that someone shouldn't follow links (lest people actually learn something refuting them).
I have posted easily five thousand links on this forum. All of my posts are archived on this forum and easily viewable. Not one of those links have ever been reported as, or shown to be in any way harmful or leading to anything other than standard mainstream news sources back up my claims. If the wanna be ankle biter would like to attempt to demonstrate otherwise, then his bluff is called.
D.
-----------
http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos...
Posted by: fayfreethinker
March 3, 2013 at 8:36 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
FFT uses an MSNBC link to prove a point about conservatives. That network has a love affair with Obama and all his liberal idiots. That network along with others carry no weight with over half of
America. All your links are extreme left wing fanatical.
Posted by: footballfan
March 3, 2013 at 10:02 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Football: "FFT uses an MSNBC link to...">>
If you had mustered up the courage to read even the first sentence you would have learned the article referred to an NBC/Wall Street Journal Poll:
"There's quite a bit to chew on in the new NBC/Wall Street Journal poll, but of particular interest was..."
When I make claims, I back them up. You should try that method. And do avoid the genetic fallacy of smearing the source while you're at it.
Footb: "All your links are extreme left wing fanatical.">>
Is the Wall Street Journal (owned by FOX), left wing fanatical? Or perhaps, you just don't know what you are talking about.
D.
-------------
http://m.static.newsvine.com/servista...
Posted by: fayfreethinker
March 3, 2013 at 10:19 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
I clicked on the msnbc link. (what courage!) Nothing bad happened.
The NYT also has similar data:
http://tinyurl.com/ch4ry64
There's more at the Pew Research Center:
http://tinyurl.com/a846l28
"GOP Seen as Principled, But Out of Touch and Too Extreme"
If anyone can find data suggesting that the Republican party is actually trusted to a greater degree than the Dems, post a link.
Posted by: FrankLloydLeft
March 3, 2013 at 11:10 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
This is actually quite amazing:
http://mashable.com/2013/03/02/wealth...
An excellent video explanation of this chart:
http://sphotos.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-p...
Posted by: fayfreethinker
March 3, 2013 at 11:11 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Great video, freethinker.
Sort of pisses one off. No, it pisses one off big-time. Too bad our conservative readers are so paralyzed with confirmation bias and fear of dangerous liberal links. They won't see it.
Doesn't leave any doubt about who has the resources to buy their own politicians and why the tax code is structured the way it is. And why conservatives who don't get it may never get it.
Posted by: FrankLloydLeft
March 3, 2013 at 11:35 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
FFT -"China has a small portion of our debt"
If that is true, my gosh, we are in worse condition than I even thought!!
Posted by: mycentworth
March 4, 2013 at 8:56 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
footballfan says "We are going to be exactly like Europe very soon."
Which part of Europe would that be? (There are 27 countries in Europe.)
Luxembourg and Norway still have much higher GDP per capita than U.S., and .Switzerland is about the same as U.S.
Posted by: Coralie
March 4, 2013 at 2:33 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Money says "OK the one who left the padded cell open that enabled wavettore to get to a computer ..."
Takes one to know one.
Posted by: Coralie
March 4, 2013 at 2:38 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
FFT said: "China has a small portion of our debt">>
MyC: "If that is true,...">>
It is true. Here's the break down in one easy chart:
http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos...
MyC: "...my gosh, we are in worse condition than I even thought!!">>
To put it bluntly, what you think, and what is actually the case, rarely tend to overlap. When you said: "More debt to China," you were just regurgitating what you've heard endlessly repeated on the right-wing media noise machine. Or as GW Bush's own speech writer put it, you are being lied to by the "conservative entertainment complex." See below.
D.
------
"I believe the Republican Party is a party of followership. The problem with the Republican leaders is that they're cowards.... The real locus of the problem is the Republican activist base and the Republican donor base. They went apocalyptic over the past four years. And that was exploited by a lot of people in the conservative world. I won't soon forget the lupine smile that played over the head of a major conservative institution when he told me that our donors think the apocalypse has arrived.
Republicans have been fleeced and exploited and lied to by a conservative entertainment complex... I'll say it again ... the conservative followership has been fleeced, exploited and lied to by the Conservative Entertainment Complex. Because the followers, the donors and the activists are so mistaken about the nature of the problems the country faces the nature--I mean, it's just a simple question. I went to Tea Party rallies and I would ask this question: "have taxes gone up or down in the past four years?" They could not answer that question correctly. Now it's true that taxes will go up if the President is re-elected. That's why we're Republicans. But you have to know that taxes have not gone up in the past. And "do we spend a trillion dollars on welfare?" Is that true or false? It is false. But it is almost universally believed."
--David Frum, adviser and speechwriter to GW Bush
Posted by: fayfreethinker
March 4, 2013 at 3:32 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
That "takes one to know one" comment was real clever, Coralie. Did it require a lot of thoughtful planning to come up with it or was it just something left over from your government education?
Posted by: Moneymyst
March 4, 2013 at 6 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Given your apparent and persistent disinclination to learn (or even know) much of anything about the actual topics of these threads or, indeed, most of the sidetracks and rabbit-holes (whether introduced by you or by others), "takes one to know one" seems a logical explanation for your sudden burst of reasonable speculation. If you in fact had to study the matter of sanity as it applies to wavetorre's post, then by all means please apply such rigorous preparation to your future comments as well.
Posted by: AlphaCat
March 4, 2013 at 6:22 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
The estimated population of the United States is 314,533,410
so each citizen's share of this debt is $52,943.22.
If that doesn't make you sick, I don't know what would. What right does the government have putting its citizens in such a burdensome life? The waste is absolutely ridiculous, as is proven more every day.
Posted by: mycentworth
March 4, 2013 at 8:36 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
US debt to China and the effects of it are summed up here in this Forbes article from January 2013:
http://www.forbes.com/sites/kenrapoza...
China makes mucho money on the US and using that as leverage in the naitonal defense arena isn't likely according the experts.
Posted by: Tankersley101
March 4, 2013 at 9:23 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
MyC: "If that doesn't make you sick, I don't know what would.">>
How about a person going on about something they don't understand? Mindlessly repeating Fox Box talking points they clearly don't grasp?
Wouldn't that make you sick Mycent? It should. It's not clear you even know what the debt is.
Start here: "Debunking Deficit Hysteria" http://blogs.lclark.edu/hart-landsber...
More good info on the debt situation here: "Fix the Debt's Fuzzy Math" http://www.thenation.com/article/1730...
A comparison of annualized federal spending growth of each president going back to Reagan: http://tinyurl.com/77n6ayx
Notice Obama's is lowest. See chart comparison with Reagan here: http://talkingpointsmemo.com/images/g...
Low information and no information conservatives cry crocodile tears about a debt they don't understand because they don't have much else to talk about (not counting gays and abortion). And yet they were, and are, masters of it's creation. Nicely shown in one chart: http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos...
D.
---------------
"8 Facts That Prove Our Govt. Is Not Going Broke" (Oct 8, 2012)
http://www.alternet.org/economy/8-fac...
Excerpt:
"Pete Peterson, the billionaire former private equity mogul, is quietly funding a noisy bus tour to whip up debt hysteria across the land. The “Ten Million a Minute Tour” headed by the Peterson Foundation’s former CEO, David M. Walker (and featuring such economic soothsayers as Alan Greenspan and Ross Perot) will end this week in Washington, DC after traveling coast to coast to alert America about the myriad of alleged dangers posed by government debt and deficits.
Really, it should be called the “Million an Hour” cavalcade because that’s about how much Peterson and company made, in part, through obscene tax loopholes designed for private equity firms and hedge funds. If there really is a debt problem, then Peterson and his fellow tax-evading financial moguls have contributed mightily to it.
But America does not face a debt crisis. Nor are we likely to face one in the next 100 years. In fact, we are the last country on Earth that needs to worry about its public debt.
What’s really behind the debt histrionics is a relentless effort by these Very Important People to use a trumped-up crisis to shred the social safety net and bring forth their bleak vision of a dog-eat-dog society where government provides for no one (except the super-rich). Unfortunately, many liberals are also buying into a “debt crisis” that doesn’t exist.
It’s time to inoculate ourselves from deficit hysteria. The first step is recognizing that virtually everything we read and hear about government debt and deficits is misleading, manipulative or just plain wrong. So, here’s your handy guide to the eight biggest lies." --ibid
Posted by: fayfreethinker
March 4, 2013 at 9:32 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Hey Tank, that was a good article.
I used to be a big deficit hawk, then I studied it more and learned that I was wrong.
Posted by: fayfreethinker
March 4, 2013 at 9:40 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
RE "What right does the government have putting its citizens in such a burdensome life?"
Well, golly-- how much was/is the mortgage on your house? What right does a bank have putting its borrowers in such a burdensome life? When you buy a house (the American Dream, you know), you pay a mortgage-- probably the biggest debt you'll ever incur (until you have a run-in with the American health care "system"). When you live in an exceptional (according to some) nation that has no peer (according to some), you pay to live there. Freedom isn't free, you know.
Of course the difference is, in the case of your mortgage you owe money to a bank, and if you don't pay, you lose the house. (If you don't pay your rent, you end up on the street.) In the case of the national debt, you owe money to yourself, and there's no demand to pay the debt on a schedule, so you won't lose your country if your part of the debt isn't paid. Don't want your poor sad life to be so burdensome? Go live in a less exceptional country-- one with peers. Or even better: don't demand payment on the debt. Most Americans are smart enough to know that; however, you can untwist your knickers, even if you don't know why. You're not going to end up on Ghana Street, or France Street, or whatever other street you're afraid you'll have to live on.
Posted by: AlphaCat
March 4, 2013 at 11:54 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
AlphaCat,
I agree with your assetion that there is a price to pay for living in the greatest country in the world. And as I have already pointed out by citing a Forbes article, the US debt to China isn't a great security threat as believed by many according to some experts. However, our current fiscal habits have "long term implications for the economy" as pointed out in the same article.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/kenrapoza...
Posted by: Tankersley101
March 5, 2013 at 12:29 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Tank: "as I have already pointed out by citing a Forbes article...">>
Oh, meant to mention, you've got to watch Forbes lately, as this article points out (Cracked has been doing some good work lately).
Warning: Raunchy language at the link:
***
"5 Easy Ways to Spot a B.S. News Story on the Internet"
http://www.cracked.com/blog/5-easy-wa...
Excerpt:
"Oh, and do you still recognize Forbes as the highbrow magazine for investor types? Because guess what: Their website now hosts hundreds of unedited blogs from random, often unpaid writers off the street. Seriously, you can write for them if you want. So now any time you see a Forbes.com story and the URL has "sites/(some dude's name here)" in the middle, you're not reading a news story from professional Forbes reporters/editors, you're reading a blog post from some random person. That's why you can see a "Forbes" article claiming that a majority of scientists doubt global warming -- in reality, it's a press release written by a shill for the Heartland Institute, an oil-industry-funded group that ran billboards comparing environmentalists to serial killers.
Remember, there's a lot of money to be made from bull[...] -- that traffic pays the same as any, and they're getting very good at tricking us into doing their promotional work for them. And that goes double if ...
#4. It's From the [blank]ing Daily Mail (or Another U.K. Tabloid)"
The rest: http://www.cracked.com/blog/5-easy-wa...
Posted by: fayfreethinker
March 5, 2013 at 12:55 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
FFT,
That article is absolutely from Forbes, as the URL would suggest. Are you picking and choosing which parts of the article to agree with, just so I am clear?
Posted by: Tankersley101
March 5, 2013 at 2:03 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Good article, Tankl. I sure hope those US banks that hold most our debt, don't get too big to fail again. China may be more trustworthy. Our working taxpayers have a big burden; I hope we can keep them working and making money. That seems to be a problem, also.
What a big economic mess!
Posted by: mycentworth
March 5, 2013 at 8:25 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
>>Good article, Tankl. I sure hope those US banks that hold most our debt, don't get too big to fail again. <
It is a good article, Tank and the very same thing I learned in Econ 101 back before cars had computers.
But leave it to Roger Ailes and Company to create near-hysteria when there's reason for none.
What difference would it make if banks are too big to fail?
Here's something in the money game you folks don't seem to grasp: Banks will never be liable for anything, at least not the major players who control 80% of the banking. Money is created out of thin air, just a few lines of computer code is all that's needed. Then it begins to flow down. Later down the chain it becomes a trickle.
Money is strictly a human creation. However, it is used to value your time which is all anyone truly has.
Posted by: cdawg
March 5, 2013 at 3:28 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
I certainly hope that no ball cap wearing, regularly posting, government employee(s) will be negatively affected by the sequester.
Our One True God would surely stop any real American hero from being forced to come home to his/her family. He certainly wouldn't make such a hero have to live in some place like Springdale.
Nor would our One True God (or the Republicans) add insult to injury to our hero by making them then have to pay taxes on his/her income.
While I thank him/her for their service . . . well, what's up with that tax break?
Posted by: GenBuckTurgidson
March 6, 2013 at 5:47 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
cdawg,
I also have taken ECON101(was microecon for me.. wish now I'de have taken macro), and I get what you are saying about the creation of money. I think that the long term effects of over spending (printing more money) are relative to consumer and lender confidence, both domestically and globally.
Buck,
Hope you are doing good today, good sir.
----------------------------------------------------------
Your friendly ballcap wearing "young man" serving else where but thinkin' bout the Ozarks everyday
Posted by: Tankersley101
March 6, 2013 at 11:49 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Buck,
I'm not for the tax break on the military members that claim Arkansas residency. I love my state and have not changed my legal residency because I want to pay my share in to the state and have for the entirety of my enlistment (minus combat tax exclusions that are automatic in all states). Not everyone feels the same way. But those that really had a problem paying state taxes probably have already changed their residency at the first given chance.
Tank
Posted by: Tankersley101
March 7, 2013 at 12:23 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
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